Hi All,

I am trying model frit glass with varying percentage of silk screened converge (assuming dot pattern from 20% to 60%) to determine the work plane illuminance levels and glare.  I have been going through both Diva and radiance online discussion forum (see attached word file).  Some discussion (by Greg Ward and Jack de Valpine ) seem indicate the use of “glaze.cal” or glaze.chs “ script  and the Jacks method involves using combination of steps using Optics, a “Optics2glazedb” function or script and “glaze.cal” .  I have also come across a suggestion that "Trans" material can be used to approximate frit glass, though not the ideal way to represent it.  

So far , I only able to get the glazing system radiance file output (i.e. without frit- since IGDB does not have frit)  using in Optics 6  and I am not clear how to go about the next steps.

The questions I have :

1) How to bring in the frit and its properties in DIVA for Rhino .( I am able to determine the effective VLT values using LBNL window 7.2, but it does not give other outputs)

2) How to call for” glaze.cal” using DIVA for Rhino ( I am familiar the process of material.rad editing)

3) The glazing in my Rhino model is represented a single surface, how does the glaze.cal script work, since it ask for surfaces for my interpretation of the discussion threads.

4) Or is it relative simple to use trans material , if so,  how to go about determining the  reflected specularity(Rs) , Surface Roughness(Sr) , diffuse Transmission (Td) and specurlar Transmission (Ts) and other parameters for a frit glass assembly.

I am looking to model following is a example form Viracon product selection.

1/4" (6mm) clear VE-85 #2 and 60% Coverage V175 #2

1/2" (13.2mm) argon space

1/4" (6mm) clear

 

IAny help or suggestion would be of great help.

http://www.radiance-online.org/community/workshops/2009-boston-ma/P...

Regards,

Aditya

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Hi Aditya,

In Jack's presentation, he added the frit definitions by hand, and all of the other coated / uncoated surfaces came from Optics.

The glaze script is a C Shell script, so you would have to install something like cygwin to run it. This all gets pretty advanced, as its basically a Unix emulator for Windows.

Cal files, as long as they are saved in C:\DIVA\Radiance\lib\, do not need any special treatment to be called or found from a material.rad file.

I believe the output of the glaze script also gets applied to a single surface as the output is a single BRTDfunc material.

I actually think if you want to be highly specific, the glaze script is the best way, but its probably not an easy way. If you know the percent diffusion versus specular transmission of your fritted window, you can get a pretty good approximation of the transmissive properties with a trans material at least.

I've never used any of these tools before, so this is the best advice I can offer.

All the best,

Alstan

Alstan,

Thank you for the feedback and insight into the workings of glaze script. At this point i am not familiar with the C shell or cygwin based Radiance to use it.

I decided to go with the trans material option for reasonably frit glass approximation. However, I am still struggling to come up with the Transmitted specularity(Ts), Diffuse Transmission(Td) , Reflected specularity(Rs) and the Diffuse reflectance (Cr, Cg,Cb).

Any suggestion on how to estimate or get the above values to calculate the A1 to A7 values for trans material ? 

Best,

Aditya


J. Alstan Jakubiec said:

Hi Aditya,

In Jack's presentation, he added the frit definitions by hand, and all of the other coated / uncoated surfaces came from Optics.

The glaze script is a C Shell script, so you would have to install something like cygwin to run it. This all gets pretty advanced, as its basically a Unix emulator for Windows.

Cal files, as long as they are saved in C:\DIVA\Radiance\lib\, do not need any special treatment to be called or found from a material.rad file.

I believe the output of the glaze script also gets applied to a single surface as the output is a single BRTDfunc material.

I actually think if you want to be highly specific, the glaze script is the best way, but its probably not an easy way. If you know the percent diffusion versus specular transmission of your fritted window, you can get a pretty good approximation of the transmissive properties with a trans material at least.

I've never used any of these tools before, so this is the best advice I can offer.

All the best,

Alstan

Hi Aditya,

I don't have a great answer for you, but I would focus most on getting the transmission correct. Probably more error in the reflected components is acceptable.

Best,

Alstan

Hello,

This an older post, but still relevant.  I have read through as much of the discussions on the glaze script and modeling frit materials as I could find and have installed Cygwin and tried to run the glaze.csh script using bash glaze.csh at the command line and it returns the following syntax error:

$ bash glaze.csh
/usr/bin/glaze.csh: glaze.csh: line 26: syntax error near unexpected token `(' /usr/bin/glaze.csh: glaze.csh: line 26: `set sn_arr=("VE1-2M low-E coating" "PVB laminated" "V-175 white frit" "V-933 warm gray frit")'

Opening the script in a unix script editor, I see various other "errors" highlighted, so I am guessing using the script on CYGWIN on windows is a no go...cause it appears the script works fine for others on MAC/Unix systems.

If there is something else going on here, would love to know how to resolve and run the script.

Thank you for all the posts and discussions on this topic.

Best,

Jeffrey

So can't use BASH to run a CSH script.  As far I can tell, I can't get CYGWIN to switch to a C shell...

Hello Jeffrey,

You are moving into some uncharted territory for me, but you should be able to get started using the 'tcsh' package in Cygwin.

Best,

Alstan

Thank you for nudge Alstan!

After a day spent getting Radiance installed on a MAC (for which I showed little natural aptitude but much perseverance) and getting the script to successfully run on the Mac Terminal, I saw your post and ran the installer for CYGWIN again, selecting the TCSH installer package and then had to run the following to tell it to open in the TCSH instead of the BASH shell:

mkpasswd -c | sed -e 'sX/bashX/tcshX' | tee -a /etc/passwd

I opened the TCSH shell, navigated to a home sub-directory where I had copied glaze, rcalc, optics2glazedb, ev and SUCCESS! - Glaze script running on a Windows 10 machine. 

So began with no access, ended the day with 2 options...I'll take that!

Thanks again for your reply and the other great information in these discussion pages that helped me sort how best to model my frit materials for simulation.

Best,

Jeffrey

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